I thought if I could be the perfect child, um, if I could be clever enough, if I could be, um, quiet enough, um, maybe I won't get into trouble today. for much of her life, Simone Bauer struggled to believe she was enough. She wondered how anyone could love her and felt as if there was something fundamentally wrong with her. Simone says childhood trauma, growing up with an abusive father who struggled with alcohol addiction, sent her down a dangerous path that included an eating disorder, addiction, and depression. After years of therapy and hard work, Simone found healing and now uses what she's learned to help others who are struggling What is your reasoning for wanting to do X, Y, Z for so-and-so?" If the answer eventually leads back to, um, I don't want them to leave me, then I, then I know that I'm potentially going to be acting on an, in an unhealthy manner for myself. Right. So even behaviors that are positive and seem, seem like a good thing, you have to look at the underneath the why, why you're doing that. Is it… and I think very few people, whether they suffer from substance use disorder or not, ever wanna do that, right? Because those are hard things to look at. You know, what is my true motivation for behaving? And this may look altruistic, but really it's a, it's a, comes from a deep insecurity, Our guest today has walked through some of the darkest places a person can go and came back with a light to share. Simone Bauer is an author, an operations manager, and the founder of Light Within Collective, a platform built around compassionate conversations on trauma, recovery, and emotional wellbeing. She survived complex trauma, addiction, an eating disorder, and treatment-resistant depression, and along the way she learned what it actually takes to move from surviving to living. Simone blends her own lived experience with a background in psychology, focusing on the nervous system, the language of survivor- survival, and healing without shame. Through her writing, her speaking, and her therapeutic card decks, she offers real hope, grounded understanding, and proof that even after profound darkness, the light does come back. Welcome, Simone. I am so grateful to talk to you all the way from South Africa. Hi, Angela. It's lovely to be here with you We should just start by diving into talking about Simone, the younger Simone, and some of the things that you went through. Uh, I talked about trauma. We talked about eating disorders, you know, perfectionism, all of these things. Where would you like to start with your story? Um, let's start at the beginning, um, and see where, see where it takes us. so, um, growing up, my, my biological father is, um, an alcoholic. Um, so I grew up in a very dysfunctional home. Um, and with the alcoholism came, um, an extremely narcissistic personality as well. Um, so I was… M- my daily life was living in trauma, basically. You know, whether it be, um, verbal abuse, physical abuse, um, there was, there was always an element, an element of it. Um, and I started to find ways or, or patterns, that I thought could keep me safe. So I thought if I could be the perfect child, um, if I could be clever enough, if I could be, um, quiet enough, um, maybe I won't get into trouble today. Maybe I can, survive this day. even I, I would also listen to, um, the sound of his car door closing at night, um, because that would dictate to me who was going to walk in the front door. Would it be the monster or would it be my dad? Um, so I became, yes, I became very attuned to noises and my surroundings from a very, very young age Don't you think there are so many people in the world who grow up, because I can relate to some of what you're saying. While I didn't grow up with an alcoholic, I grew up in a home where there's instability, right? That you're looking for safety and security as a child, and when you don't have that, when behaviors are volatile or, you know, you're always on edge, right? You just never know w- what's coming next. And I think a lot of us, and I'm sure that's where my case of perfectionism comes from is, you know, you try to do everything perfectly to keep things stable, but it's impossible. It's impossible to do Definitely. Um, it's almost the, the harder one tries, the more out of reach it feels. Um, and, and so I, I mean, I would turn myself inside out to try and be that perfect child. You know, if I, if I got 9 out of 10 on a test at school, that was completely unacceptable. Um, if I didn't win the hockey match or score a goal, And I knew that there was, um, I was going to hear about it, that I did not excel, um, to his standards, I guess. Um, and then so, so in my experience, I, I learned all of these sort of people-pleasing, um, perfectionism, um, behaviors. And eventually trying to keep up with all of, with all of those behaviors became incredibly painful and difficult, as well as they stopped working, um, it- They were not able to control my environment. They were not able to control the way my father was responding. Um, and so that's when I, I first actually turned towards an eating disorder at a very young age. you developed an eating disorder. Is eating… Are eating disorders about control, do you think? Yes. So, um, definitely. I think because I've had-- because the behav- the pa- the, the behaviors I was, I was doing were not, um, controlling my environment enough, needed control something um, food became, became the next, the next thing. And, it would start with like storing food in my cheeks and then throwing it away when no one was looking, my school lunches. At, um, at one stage, um, my mom came into my bedroom and underneath my bed there was weeks and weeks worth of school lunches that I had been hiding under my bed, um, that my, my parents were not aware of. and the reason why I either had to… I had to hide it under my bed because if my father were to see that I had not eaten my lunch, would be in, in such huge trouble, um, that I needed to find a way, a way around that. So I would hide-- I would empty the Tupperwares and hide the food underneath my bed. Um, and then as I got older, it progressed, um, down different avenues and around the age of 14 is when I started experimenting, um, with alcohol and substances Were you ever treated for your eating disorder? So, um, much later Later. Hmm. Um, at the-- Yes, yes Okay, so at the time, maybe that probably, a lot of that, those patterns of behavior probably carried on and then you began to use alcohol. Did you start with alcohol? Yeah. Correct. Behind every overdose statistic is a person who was loved. The Into Light Project is putting a face to those we've lost, humanizing the addiction and drug crisis one story at a time. Artists create graphite portraits of people who have died from addiction, overdose, fentanyl poisoning, or drug-induced homicide. A professional writer crafts a narrative to go with each portrait so the person's story is told alongside their image. When it's finished, the family keeps the original artwork. Exhibits are opening in South Dakota, Illinois, Missouri, South Carolina, and Maine, and submissions are open right now. If you've lost someone you love to this crisis, this is a chance to make sure their story is seen and remembered. Submit your loved one's story to intolightproject.org/share-your-story. That's intolightproject.org/share-your-story, and we've put a link in the show notes to this podcast. At 14, Simone began drinking alcohol to cope with the abuse and her mental health struggles. Around the same time, her parents divorced, adding another change to an already challenging period in her life Which was the best thing for the family. Um, however, I was still forced to spend time with my father, so the constant, the daily, um, of traumatic experiences didn't end, didn't end for me when my parents got divorced. I was unfortunately still in the, middle of everything. um, I was, I was eventually diagnosed at around the age of 14 for the first time, um, with depression. Um, and I did go into a inpatient treatment facility at that time, um, because I was incredibly suicidal. So from the age of 14, I've, I've really struggled, um, with feeling suicidal, su- suicidal ideation. So your parents were divorced. You continued to have to deal with your dad and the volatile behavior, and also the dema- it sounds like your father was very demanding, wanted you to be pr- have sort of ex- sort of invoked that perfectionism inside of you. Um, you're dealing with an eating disorder. You're, you're, you're drinking, and you're depressed and suicidal, which we know alcohol is also a depressant. Um, at that time, were you able to get help? Um, I was seeing a therapist and a psychiatrist, um, and I, I did do inpatient treatment, but that was really, um, a last-minute resort to kind of, uh, stop me from ending my life. And I eventually did, um, get the help that I needed, um, but that was at the age of 22. Okay, so that's quite a long time. So what can you tell us, because I have had parents on this show whose children have completed suicide, and when you have those suicide ideations like you were having as a teenager, what do you understand about it now maybe that you didn't understand about it then? you know, in my, in my own lived experience, um, the pain was just so enormous and I couldn't, uh, as a young teenager, I couldn't foresee how things would get better. I couldn't foresee a future where this would not be my reality. Um, and it truly felt like would be my only escape, um, my only way out. And, and I often, I often say, and it's, it is, it is my truth. Um, so I, I eventually cut contact with my father when I was 20 years old, and the reason at that time was either I would be-- if I, if I kept that relationship alive, either he would be successful in, in ending my life or I would be successful in ending my life. That was the way the relationship was going to end. like with the, with the suicidality, like even as an adult when I've had those really dark times, it's so debilitating because everywhere you look, you see avenues, um, to end your life. You'll see, you know, you'll see a glass and I can break the glass. I'm not gonna go into, I don't want to discuss methods, right Um, m- my point is just that everywhere you look, literally your mind is just making,"Okay, that I can use, that I can use. This is what I can do." It is so, so debilitating Yes, it's, it's horrible and, and it's so sad as well at the same time to not be able to see a future that's any better. And you're, you know, you're experiencing all this as a teenager. You start using alcohol. Eventually you move on to stimulants. How, how bad did it get with the substances for you? You know, the program part of their speak of jails, institutions, and death. Um, and I had been in two of the three already. and it had caused significant, significant harm, um, to my relationship with my mom and stepdad, with friendships. Um, people did not want to have a friendship with me any longer. Um, you know, I was arrested. I… I'm so ashamed to admit it, but it is part of the truth. Um- I, I have stolen, in order to, to be able to use. Um, and I want to also just, um, I may, so I only started using substances… No, sorry. I, I used alcohol from the age of 14, as we mentioned. Um, but it was only after the death of my cousin that I then, um, adding in, other drugs Well, we know that substance use disorder, so many people, it's rooted in grief, right? And for you, the grief started young, and we can have grief about all kinds of things. We can have grief about not having the love of par- of a parent or f- not feeling like we had the love of a parent, right? And then the grief, tell me about your cousin and why that led to you using other substances. Sure. So, um, I'm an only child, um, I am also the youngest, um, all of the cousins. And cousin, um, she, she is three years older than me. Almost like from when I was born, she became like my person. We were inseparable. We were like sisters. We had that sisterly relationship even though we weren't technically sisters. And, um, she was someone who, who I could really just be myself around. I didn't have to put on these masks. I didn't have to pretend. I didn't have to be a chameleon. I could just be whoever… I could just show up as I was, whatever that meant in the moment. Um, and I did… I know, like, we had so much fun together and, um, she's just such a light. She's, she was just such a wonderful, wonderful human being. Um, and she has two gorgeous children, um, and they were unfortunately very young when she passed away. Um, and her story is a very sad story. Um, we… She had not, she had never used in her life, um, until the very end. She got into a relationship, and I was actually there the first time she tried a substance. And my nickname is Moni. Moni, that's what she called me. She came into my room and her exact words were, "Moni, don't be angry with me, but I've just tried X." And do you say? I just said, "I'm not angry. I just hope you know what you're doing." And it obviously, you know, it just escalated, the addiction. It was more and more and, then needing a strong- stronger substance, et cetera. she eventually passed away, and it happened probably within a two-year period, so it wasn't a long, Wow it wasn't a long timeframe. And world… I was I'll never, I'll never forget the, um, the night my mom got that phone call from my aunt. And I could tell something was wrong because my mom went into the bedroom and closed her bedroom door to answer the call, which was strange behavior for her. And I was busy baking a cheesecake, and I had a towel, a towel in my hand, and my mom came to me and, and as she was trying to tell me, before she could get the words out, I'd already backed myself into a corner, and I was li- I was hitting with the tea towel, thinking that I could… I knew what she was… Like, my body just knew was, what was gonna be said. And I s- and I was hitting the tea towel out in an attempt to try and keep the reality, the truth of what she's gonna tell me from being true. And the pa- the, the sound that came out of me was indes- you know, it's indescribable. And, um, and then I, and then in a, in a twisted way in my mind, I thought, "If I can, um… Maybe I should try what she was doing. Figure out what, um, figure out what was so powerful about this. Maybe I can be closer to her. Maybe it'll help me understand why, why, what was so amazing that it, that it was worth losing your life for." I know it's, I know it's not as black and white as what I'm saying, but, know, in that grief and that chaos in my mind, that's what my thoughts were, were doing. That's so interesting to me 'cause you're not the first person I've heard say something like that. I- well, not even say something. I know of an actual case where a mother, her son died from fentanyl poisoning, and then she took fentanyl and died, which just shocked me, right? But it doesn't make logical sense. Um, but there is something about the brain. Does it, the brain doesn't always make sense, and when you have such a profound loss… And what was your cousin's name? Candy. And how old was Candy when she died? 20… 24, 25 Okay. So 20, so young, 24, and you're three years younger, um, so you were like 21 years old when this happened, and your brain's not fully developed at that point, and you'd already been using substances and gone through an eating disorder and, you know, the, so you're, it's not like your brain was set up to be healthy in the first place. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Well, I'm so sorry for your loss. And was it an ov- Did Candy die of an overdose? Um, what makes this, what makes this so much harder is the family, as the family, we still don't have any answers. Um Yeah. We don't know That is so difficult to live with So this trauma that continues in your life, I mean, the trauma you had growing up, you lose your, your cousin who's like a sister to you, and I have a cousin growing up that was like a sister to me as well, so I understand that. And you s- you, did you just start down that path of using more substances, and how bad did it get then after Candy died? Mm-hmm. Um, so yes, I did, I did continue down that path. Um, I think it's also an important part of that is that I then also… So I'd, I'd stopped, I'd cut contact with my dad, by, by the time passed away. However, I'd gotten myself then into very unhealthy and toxic romantic relationships. Um, I s- I had this, um, innate desire that I just needed, I just wanted to be loved. And I would always, I would always pick almost the most unlikely person. Um, and then I would tell myself, once again, this is not gonna make logical sense, but this is what was going on in my brain. And it would be this thing of, if I can make this person love me, then maybe I really am lovable. Because out of everyone, if this person can love and accept me, then maybe I'm okay so the one relationship, in particular, there was a number of years and it started around the time of Candy's passing, also encouraged the, um, the use of substances. And so, and I mean, I'm ashamed to admit that I, I have, I have done things that I, I don't even know what I was taking. I would just whatever there was, didn't matter what it was, didn't matter how sick it made me, how ill I felt. Um, it didn't matter what the consequences were. I have had a, a broken ankle, and instead of going to the hospital to get it checked out, I'm sitting in a dealer's house, because that was, that, that's all it was about. It didn't matter. Nothing else mattered. Um, Nothing else mattered. accidents, nothing else mattered, and I think that's such an interesting thing, and it's hard for someone like me and probably many of our listeners who are trying to have a better unders- understanding of substance use disorder or addiction of how it gets to the point where nothing else matters but, you know, getting that substance. And it is hard for others to understand. I think anybody who's walked in your shoes gets it right away, right? Anybody who has, has been, found themselves suffering from addiction gets that. But it gets to the point, and I've heard many people say this, you're not the first, that nothing else mattered Y- yes, and it's a, it's a very, very sad truth to admit to, um, especially Once one has moved away from that sort of an environment and has a clearer mind, the insanity of those words that nothing else mattered, um, when you think of people that love you, your family, and yet in that moment, none of that, really none of that matters. It's not what you're thinking about. And I think for, for each individual it will be different. For me, using was an escape. My life was so pa- the reality of my life was so, so painful. um, I have See, I have a, a lot, a lot, a lot, a lot of trauma. Um, and using allowed me to not have to face the reality of those traumas. Putting substances down would mean taking a hard look at myself, a hard look at my life, to feel the feelings. Um, I mean, I… Angela, I can say that since I've, I've been in recovery nine years Oh. from substances, and recovery has been the most painful time of my life. And it's simply because I'm now, I'm now left with- Everything that I've been running from my whole life and numbing with, um, an eating disorder, with self-harm, with alcoholism, with substance use. The, all of those, um, coping mechanisms are now gone, and I'm left with the reality, it is incredibly, incredibly painful That makes sense to me. There is one thing I wanted to ask you about with your substance use. Because your dad used substances, alcohol, and that made your life so frightening and set you down this course, why didn't his use deter you from using? Because I think there… People can go one of two ways, right? Like, y- you hear of people who grow up in a home where drugs or alcohol are used, and they go the opposite way, and then some people follow in the same family dysfunctional pattern. Why didn't his use… Why didn't you think, "Well, I'm never gonna do what he's doing because I know how awful it is"? Mm-hmm. Um, that's a great question, and I do have, um, members who they've seen what alcoholism to families and within our family and have completely steered away from, from alcohol. They will not touch it. if I can be completely transparent, I think at the age when I started, which was 14, um, and the, the headspace I was in, the emotional turmoil, the, the being suicidal, I don't-- I, I could not think rationally. Right that rational… I, I wasn't able to have that rational conversation as to, "Yes, but this is what's causing you so much pain. Why on earth would you then go and do the exact same thing?" My brain was incapable, to be honest, of having that rational dialogue Yeah, that makes sense. And then you mentioned for nine years now you have been in recovery. W- but you started telling me just how bad it got that, that, that, you know, nothing else mattered. What, what changed? What made you want to stop and, and face those feelings and all of the uncomfortableness that goes along with that? So I, I went into treatment specifically for an eating disorder, and I thought that that's what I was going into treatment, And how old how old were, you at this point? Um, so this was when I was 27 Okay Yeah. And I did six weeks at, uh, inpatient at a treatment center and they said, "Nope, you need longer-term care." Ah? Um, and they weren't a long-term care facility, so they transferred me to a different treatment center where I ended up spending 20 months. Well, 20 months, I mean, actually that's really good to hear because the brain takes a long time to recover. I don't know what the systems are like in South Africa. In the United States, we have a lot of short-term 30-day recoveries because that's what insurance will cover, and we know that that's just a random number, right? That it just takes a lot longer for people to recover from these types of things. But we don't have the systems and, I mean, long-term recovery, that doesn't ex- barely exists in the United States Mm-hmm. So I must, I must, um, be honest with regards to that. So typically, yes, um, 30-day treatment centers are definitely what's common in South Africa. Actually 21 days No what, uh, medical will cover. Um, I was… I have been incredibly fortunate where my mom and stepdad literally Moved to Earth to get me the help. It wasn't covered by medical. Hmm. it, it was paid by my family. Um, and that's not because the money was there. Um, you know, you know, they had to make a plan for that to happen. Well, And, well they did what they had to do because they loved you and, and that's what… And I've, and again, I have talked to many families who have spent hundreds of thousands of dollars, right, trying to get their child the help they need Yeah. And so w- when I was in the longer term care, it became not just about the eating disorder, it became let's look at everything. And it was, "You're an alcoholic. You are an addict. You are codependent." Every single thing, process addictions, substance addictions, was all looked at and I had to confront it. And, um, and it was tough. There, there wasn't an easy way out. And I remember I was phoning my mom absolute tears, like so angry, begging her to get me out of this place, and she refused to let me leave, which was-- well, I mean, that was obviously the best thing she could have done. um, it's… I'm not sure if you potentially have heard, heard about this as well in, um, within your, your work. When, when the addiction is threatened, um, you become angry and volatile, and it's the addiction that's, that's, um, actually spewing out that anger and that hatred that hurt because it's threatened. Um, so I was very fortunate that my mom was able to actually push back and say, "You will stay." I think that's so hard for parents, and I know I encountered a lot of anger from Emily when I was trying to stop my daughter, when I was trying to stop certain behaviors, trying to, you know, get to the root of the problem because it's the, it's not the per- That wasn't really Simone. That wasn't really you. That was your addiction coming through because the addiction wants to survive at all costs. It's, it's bizarre, but it explains a lot Mm-hmm. And as you said, it is so incredibly hard for a parent, um, to have to stand firm and just, yes, stand firm against it. And so I was very fortunate that I was in that, in that environment where I could start… Again, you know what the thing- you know what? I think when you only have 21 or 30 days in a, in a safe treatment facility environment, um- Obviously part of that time is detoxing, um, at that, and you know, during that time there's not really any therapeutic work that can, that can take place because it's more of a physical detox. Um, and so there's very little time actually left, um, for one to really do the deep hard work, . Whereas I feel because I was fortunate enough to have the longer term treatment, in a contained environment I truly got to experience what a life in recovery could look like. Are you ready to protect the next generation from the dangers of substance use? Emily's Hope has created a comprehensive K through 12 substance use prevention curriculum designed to educate, empower, and equip students with the tools they need to make healthy choices. Our age appropriate lessons start in kindergarten and build through high school using science, real stories, and interactive learning to help kids understand their bodies, brains, and risk of drug use. We're already reaching thousands of students across multiple states, and we're just getting started. Visit emilyshopeedu.org to learn more, and share our curriculum with your school administrators and counselors. At Emily's Hope, we believe prevention begins with education. Let's work together to keep our kids safe. In addition to treatment for substance use disorder, Simone also received long overdue help for her eating disorder and mental health struggles while in inpatient treatment. If you or someone you love is struggling, please remember help is available. Your life matters. You can find a list of helpful resources on our website, emilyshope.charity. We've posted a link for you in our show notes., I'm a kind person. And one of the things that I was made to look at when, when working with the process addictions the motivation for my behaviors. So I eventually reached a point where I did not know the difference between I am inherently and what was learnt to keep me safe up. Um, and so my biggest, as an example, my biggest fears are abandonment, being unworthy, not being lovable. So yes, I may look like the kindest person willing to help jump in, but when you look at… And this is not all the time, please don't get me wrong. Um, but if I, if I take a step back and I say, "Okay, why are you-- what is your reasoning for wanting to do X, Y, Z for so-and-so?" If the answer eventually leads back to, um, I don't want them to leave me, then I, then I know that I'm potentially going to be acting on an, in an unhealthy manner for myself. Um- Right. So even behaviors that are positive and seem, seem like a good thing, you have to look at the underneath the why, why you're doing that. Is it… Yes, and I think very few people, whether they suffer from substance use disorder or not, ever wanna do that, right? Because those are hard things to look at. You know, what is my true motivation for behaving? And this may look altruistic, but really it's a, it's a, comes from a deep insecurity, um, that I feel if I don't help somebody or don't always step forward, that I won't be loved or liked or accepted. And I think there's a lot of people in the world, whether they, like I said, use substances or not, that could identify with that if they really looked at it. Yeah. Yeah. Mm-hmm. And you mention how hard it is, you know, to look how hard recovery is in terms of, like, how much work it is, and to look at things you don't wanna look at, and to feel emotions that you obviously didn't wanna feel. But clearly there, uh, if it was all hard and difficult, nobody would, you wouldn't stay in recovery for nine years, right? So what is the upside of recovery? Oh, there is so much. Um, my favorite part to talk about. um, I remember in early recovery, one of the first, um, gifts, we speak about gifts of recovery, one of the first gifts I got was, um, a true belly laugh. For so many years, for the longest time that I can remember, if I laughed, it was, it was like a put on laugh because it was like, "Oh, that's what I'm supposed to do," as opposed to feeling any joy or feeling that something was truly funny, in any way. I was in treatment, and we… I don't know if this is a th- if, if this is a thing for most children or not, but when I was younger, we used to roll down hills, down Sure. Yeah, I did that too. Okay. Yes. Yeah Yes. And, and we did it, um, when, when I came into recovery. It was a, maybe a good few months into recovery, and we went rolling down the embankments, and, um, I had such a genuine belly laugh. Like, the laughter just came from my stomach, and out of my mouth. That was, th- you know, th- that's irreplaceable. Um, I- So in, in active addiction and especially with depression and that, I struggle to… The world loses its color. Um, it's-- you can't resonate, you can't actually process Um, it doesn't have any significance. And I remember the first time I saw a rainbow, truly saw a rainbow, and, um, could actually see like the different… Firstly, be able to, to be present enough in my body, in my own life, where I could notice my surroundings. That's first, that's a, a first accomplishment. And then seeing this rainbow and being able to recognize, um, the different colors. Um, having, being able to look after my dog again. Um, my mom and stepdad were looking after her when I was in treatment, so having her back in my life. Um, I've made people who know the real me, and they haven't run. They know the worst of the worst of my story. you know what? They still love me. And I have a career that I love. That would never have been possible if I was in active addiction. I would not have been able to hold down, um, a decent job, um, if I'm honest. Um- I can't, I can't-- I genuinely can't sit here and say, um, when last I have actually thought about using any substance. It is, it is-- that's not a go-to anymore in my brain. That link has… It's gone Well, that's amazing to hear, and I think the longer people are in recovery, the more that can be true. And also, so you say you have nine years, which is a, a good amount of time, and that doesn't mean you couldn't ever relapse, because it's always a possibility for anybody. But also, I've heard that you can grow out of addictions, and when you start using at such a young age, you know, your brain doesn't have the chance to develop the way it should, and your brain has probably been catching up over the la- I would imagine, over the last nine years yes. Um, and I, I think as soon as there's even a little bit in my head that thinks,"You're not an addict," I am in dangerous, dangerous territory, no matter how long I've been in recovery for. Um, one of my things that I, I need to always remember, and it is, it is part of my truth, that is that I am an addict. And, um, I am powerless. Um, one, one wrong move and I can lose absolutely everything. I, I, I don't- I don't ever want to get to a place where I feel like I'm untouchable or I'm immune to, to relapse or using again. Um, and, and maybe I'm, maybe that's not the right way to be, I don't know. But I just know that what I have in my life today, and I'm not talking about, I'm not talking about, um, things. I'm speaking about, you know, family, connections, love, um- I, I would, I wouldn't give that away for anything Right The, the important things in life, the truly important things Mm-hmm. that you can't have when you're using substances because you're not being genuine and authentic. So it's like a, it's like a coverup, right? It's like putting a cloak over yourself. Um, and you can't have those real connections, um, like you can have when you're being your authentic self, and that means no substances. And you use, you're using all, everything you've been through. You're, uh… There's a great line that I love,"Don't waste your suffering," um, by David Brooks. I think he's the one that said that, the author. And I love that because I'm, uh, through loss and grief and dealing with substance use with my daughter, I'm, I'm trying to not waste my suffering by doing this podcast and the other things that we do and the other work that I do. And I see you in the same way, not wasting your suffering. You wrote a book, Chasing Light, and I wanna ask you a little bit about that and the other work you do with others Sure. Um, yes, so Chasing Light is, the first book that I've written. and it actually, it ends weirdly enough when I come into recovery. It doesn't cover the past Mm. eight, nine years, um, because I felt that it was too painful to actually write about. Um, and I didn't know that I had the strength within me to do that. And a few months ago, well, no, towards the beginning of the year, I found myself writing again, and I've started a second book, it's going to be speaking these incredibly painful years. Um, and so Chasing Light, I… The title is very pertinent to me because I've, I, I, I've spent my whole life searching for something outside of me to make me feel okay, to make me feel better. Um, and at the end of the day, at the end, when all is said and done, if one is able to take a moment to pause and clear their mind of everything, when you, when you have some space I believe that we will all find that the light has been within us all along. It's just been buried by our life experiences, by our traumas, et cetera. And if we look, and maybe there'll just be a glimmer every now and then, and that's okay. But it's, but basically Nothing outside of me was ever going to make me feel whole, Right ever going to make me feel okay. It had to come from within. and I just used the, the imagery of the light. I love that imagery. I think it's so beautiful. and having that light within us. Um, It's such a universal truth. It's such a universal truth that there's nothing outside of ourselves that is going to make us whole. That all of the answers, everything we need, is really inside of ourselves. But many of us don't learn that until much later in life, if at all. And so Yeah it's so, it's almost the evolution of the human spirit. And I don't know who has that at a young age and keeps that always. I, I, I don't know anybody like that yes. I don't, I mean, I don't know. I also don't, um, know anyone Yeah But I think the beautiful thing is that it's still within us, and if we're willing to, we can get back there Right. You can't put it out. It's impossible to put out, but it can be covered up for a very long time, if always, you know? You can find more information about Simone's books by heading to the show notes. While you're there, we'd really appreciate it if you'd just take a moment to rate and review this podcast. It may seem like a small thing, but it really does help more people find Grieving Out Loud and hear stories like this one. You never know who may be listening who needs to hear that they're not alone and that recovery is possible. And then I also have Light Within Collective, is a platform, um, that offers trauma-informed, compassionate resources, um, various… So something that I'm really passionate about is human-centered leadership. so changing the way leaders Are currently leading, I guess. Um, how, and I'm not about… My work is not advocating that you just need to become therapists. That's not at all. But it's, it's more if we, if we can become more curious about the individual, um, and, and see them as a, as a whole being, how might I, how might I- our approach to them differ? for me, growing up, you were always told work is work, is personal. There's a divide. You keep it like that. personally don't think that that's a realistic expectation. we, we show up as we are, as whole beings. I don't think it's realistic to expect, although we can com- compartmentalize, it's not, it's not necessarily a healthy way to be living. and if we, we can acknowledge that a whole being shows up each day, um, and in doing so, they're obviously carrying d- parts of themselves from all facets of their life. Um, and how can we pro- how can we create an environment where an individual feels safe enough to, to make a mistake, to ask questions, um- Because we may also find, and this is not the case for everybody, but in some instances looks like perfection um, who is, I don't know, very detail-oriented could actually be a, a, um, a pattern that was learned from a y- at a younger age in order to keep their world safe. Um, so it's not realistic to ask someone to cut that part out because it is a part of who they are and, and how they're showing up. Anyway, that was a bit of a ramble. Um, okay, but I do think you have a very, um, interesting point there because so many of our systems, especially our work systems, corporations, governments, very patriarchal, very much like fall in line, toe the line. People are not treated as necessarily as human beings, but as workers, right? And, um, you don't necessarily check everything at the door when you walk into an office or wor- whatever your workplace may be. And we don't Definitely look at the entire person. We just look at productivity and things like that. Um, so changing those systems, it has to start from the top. It has to start with evolved leaders, enlightened, you might even say, leaders, which we don't see a lot of always in today's world. Um, and it seems to me like sometimes we're regressing even to the, to the systems that we thought worked decades ago, um, more patriarchal, more, um… I'm trying to think of the other word I'm trying to think of using, but you know what I mean, that, um, it, we're not… We need to be evolving in how we, um, do everything, and that's not always happening Definitely. Um, and, then I just quickly, I also have, um, two, uh, card decks, therapeutic card decks. um, I'm very proud of them because they also have stemmed from my own story. And the one deck is called Here Now, and it's- It's basically the adult version of, of ourselves taking the hand of our inner child, of little versions of us and saying,"It's okay, I'm here now.", The therapeutic card decks are more of a reflection, um, getting, you know, s- taking a moment to think, to go back, to have self-compassion Mm-hmm. That's And are those available on your website as well? Yes, they Okay. Well, we'll be sure to put links to those, and I think that's a very unique idea. I like that idea. Where did you get the idea to do a therapeutic card deck? Um, so part of my own he- it's, it's, it's really all from lived experience, if I'm completely honest. A part of my healing, I realized that as much as my younger self was abandoned on a day-to-day basis, as an adult, as adult Simone, I was abandoning her over and over and over again. Um, and a lot of my healing truly… Well, my healing's changed when I was finally able to look at her, accept her, offer her love. Um, and so that's where that idea stemmed from. Um, then the other deck is called I'm Still Here, and as I speak to anyone who has, you know, gone through anything, um, my intention was it to, was for it to hopefully help individuals with PTSD or CPTSD. Um, and I think that I'm Still Here is, can be such a powerful, powerful sentence. Um- In spite of everything that has happened, um, in spite of one's traumas or, negative experiences, I'm still here, and that's incredibly powerful. and I, I like to refer to that card deck as a love letter to our nervous system, um, because so much of how we respond… Uh, you know, th- this is-- there's so many avenues. Just quickly, um, one of the, the, the topics I love exploring as well is, um, when one's nervous system is wired to be in survival mode. When you're in safety, the nervous system is still acting in that survival mode and, um, how, how can we teach our nervous systems that it's okay, it's okay now? Um, can put those guards down. We're safe. So I also-- Yeah, that's another topic that I think is really interesting. Yeah, it is. It is. And so, um, so many people… And even, uh, you talked about leadership. A good leader knows how to regulate their nervous system, control their nervous system, right? Um, and so that's something that can be learned, and it's sometimes more difficult for others to do. But I just, I so appreciate you sharing your personal story and your journey, and all the resources that you have with us and with our podcast viewers and listeners as well It's been an absolute pleasure. Thank you so much for having me Thank you And thank you for listening to this episode of Grieving Out Loud. We hope you'll join us next week for another important conversation. And remember, you can always find hundreds of past episodes anytime on our website, emilyshope.charity. Thanks again for listening. Until next time, wishing you faith, hope, and courage. This podcast is produced by Casey Wonnenberg King and Kayli Fitts