Imagine losing your child to an opioid overdose, then spending years fighting to hold those partially responsible accountable. The opioid manufacturers, distributors, the pharmacies. All that grief, all that effort, all that pain, and then you win. But the money meant to prevent other overdoses isn't necessarily used the way it was intended. we're all waiting for these opioid settlement funds to come to finally do what they need to do to turn this epidemic around. And, and finally, you know, drop our overdose fatality rates back to what they were at pre epidemic levels. And then we just see them squandered, wasted, you know, Today's guest on Grieving Out Loud, Alexis Pleas, lost her son, Jeff, to an overdose. In the years since, she's turned her grief into action, working to make sure other parents don't have to go through such a difficult loss. One of her latest projects involves examining how New York State is spending its billions of dollars secured through opioid settlements.. The evidence that we found really proves this point is now we've pumped all these millions of dollars of opioid settlement funds into these existing systems that already had funding. You look at the dashboard that shows treatment. Admissions for New York State hasn't changed. No increased treatment, sub treatment, admissions, so all of that money is, is going to these systems and yet we have not increased the number of people who are getting treatment. In this episode of Grieving Out Loud, Alexis shares what her research uncovered, what she wants the public to understand, and how she's pushing for greater accountability in how opioid settlement funds are used. It seems to be that there's no mechanism of accountability out there other than families. We need to hold them responsible. We need to say, this isn't acceptable. If you've been listening to this podcast for a while, you know that one of the questions I keep coming back to is whether the resources meant to address the epidemic are actually reaching the people and organizations closest to the crisis. The families, the grassroots organizations, the people who built something out of their grief and their love for someone that they lost. That question is at the heart of today's conversation. Alexis Pleus is the founder and executive director of Tooth Farm, a community-based organization in New York doing the hard unglamorous, lifesaving work of harm reduction, family education and overdose prevention. She's been on the podcast as a guest before and she. She and her team just released a report that I think every advocate, every policy maker, and every grieving family member needs to hear about. It's called Community Solutions State Exclusions, a data-driven examination of how New York State is spending the billions of dollars secured through opioid litigation. The findings are striking. The largest organizations receive nearly 85% of discretionary funds. organizations, just three and a half percent, and not $1 has gone to support grieving families. Now, I'll be transparent. Emily's Hope has received opioid settlement funding here in South Dakota, which is exactly why this report hit close to home for me. These funds can reach the right places. The question in this report raises is whether. They truly are. And Alexis, I wanna welcome you back to Grieving Out Loud. Thank you for being here. Thank you so much for having me. It's always a pleasure to talk to you. Yeah. So nice to see you again. And tell me what prompted you to do this research and how you went about it and who helped you with it. Yeah. So, um, we have been following the opioid settlement funds since, since they came to New York and. Really before that because, you know, our organization has been on the front lines advocating about holding big pharma responsible and accountable for their actions, um, since we started in 2015. So we've, you know, had our finger on the pulse of these opioid settlement funds coming to New York and the year that they came to New York or the year they were coming, we helped get the law passed. Said the funds in New York State are gonna go into a specific pot of money, opioid settlement funds. They didn't go into our general funds, so that was great. Um, that law that we helped get passed also set up this opioid settlement advisory board. Um, and so we, you know, I kind of thought we were in the clear, I thought that we did the legwork necessary to make sure that these funds were going to be spent appropriately. We, um, right away to kind of make sure we started attending the opioid settlement advisory board meetings to see how things would go. Um, and we were pretty quickly disappointed, um, in the process. And as time went on, you know, so, um, three years into this 2025 last year, um, we, we just realized, you know, going to all these opioid sentiment advisory board meetings, making recommendations. Speaking during their public, um, comment period, and then watching the request for proposals come out and seeing grassroots organizations were simply not eligible to apply for any of these funds. We just got so frustrated. We wrote a bunch of amendments we wanted to see to that to get passed to that law that we had helped get passed in the first place. And we didn't have, um, elected officials open to that idea. And so I started doing research, like analyzing where the funds were being spent, looking at like the actual hard numbers. I was putting everything into a spreadsheet. I had a couple interns helping me. Um, and so the end of the advocacy season last year when we got nowhere with the advocacy, I was like, we need to publish this. Like we need people to see these numbers. Um, and so we pulled together a team and, and we created the report. A couple of things. New York is getting $3 billion in opioid settlement money. Is that correct? Yeah, it's a lot. It's a lot. It's much more than South Dakota is getting. I think South Dakota is getting like a hundred million dollars. We're a Oh wow. state and had fewer deaths. Right. Right, And also only 15% of New York of that money has been spent in New York. Right. Only right. And it, out. So very little yeah. been given out. Yeah, One thing I wanna remind our listeners and viewers about is that. I always say opioid settlement money is blood money. that's right. comes on the deaths of. Tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of people all across the United States caused by big pharma pushing opioid and opioid prescriptions onto the general public. what people don't understand oftentimes is the correlation between that. And what followed was the heroin epidemic followed by the fentanyl epidemic that these, these drugs flooded country because of the demand for prescription opioids. And when that was cut off, people turned to alternatives, and there were just such a larger supply of these drugs getting into people's hands. Yeah. I'm so glad you said that because we've had that conversation a lot over the past couple of days because there's, there's some things coming up with the Purdue, um, bankruptcy and criminal charges with them, that it's like we're trying to reinvigorate the community to pay attention to that issue. We hear a lot from families. Like in fact, at a meeting, one of our rainmaker meetings last night, a family member said, I don't feel like this applies to me. My brother died from a fentanyl overdose. And so I think, I think today with a lot of people dying from fentanyl overdoses or maybe their loved one was never prescribed a, an opioid prescription, that might not have been their pathway into addiction. People don't realize exactly what you just said. Really, it was the conditioning of our country to be aware of opioids, for people to become familiar with them, to want them to desire them, to recognize them as a recreational substance. All of that started with big pharma, so like. Your child might have died from a fentanyl poisoning, and maybe that was the first time they ever used a drug. It might have been in the format of a Oxycontin that was fake, but who originally made people want Oxycontin? Right? Right. and so really. And I, and I think it's important because like I said, a lot of people who've suffered, you know, from fentanyl poisoning losses, they don't tie themselves to the big pharma. But the reality is, big pharma's responsible for all of this. We wouldn't be in this situation we are today, there wouldn't be counterfeit oxys. If there weren't originally over-prescribing of oxys, you know, back in the early two thousands, that that drove this crisis nationwide. Right. It's all. one more thing I wanna mention related to that, to tie this really tightly together, is there, there's maps that show where. Purdue Pharma focused their marketing back. You know, back in the day, those locations still have higher overdose fatality rates to this day, even though now it's from Fentanyl. And so we know that. We know all of these overdoses are tied to their actions. It's blood money. Yep. all somebody needs to do is read some of Sam Quinones' books. And Sam has been a guest on this podcast and, um, I would really highly recommend you listen to that podcast to understand the correlation and the connection between prescription opioids. opioids, whether that be heroin, fentanyl, or the other analogs that are coming out. Sam Quinones is a journalist, former LA Times reporter, and author who extensively covered the opioid epidemic. He's known for his best-selling book, Dreamland: The True Tale of America's Opioid Epidemic. dreamland tells the story of the over-prescribing of pain pills that led a lot of people to grow dependent and then have to find it on the street when they lose their insurance or whatever. And then they become addicted and also they, and, and, and, and then we, then they graduate to heroin. So it's that pain pill to heroin story. Um, I just didn't understand. What was worse than heroin? You know, what could be worse than heroin? Uh, this was a, I was, you know, I've been a reporter for a long time, never had heard of fentanyl, really? Uh, um, and, and you know, I knew the story was a big one. I knew it was, it was, it was, you know, it was about who we are as Americans, what we had become as a country, this whole opioid epidemic. It was, it was about how we had kind of shredded. Community, uh, in a lot of ways in, in this countries. And, and it was also kind of a, a reflection of how we had, um, we looked for magic answers. What's the answer to all pain? Well, one pill for every human being, You can check out our full podcast with Quinones by heading to this episode's show notes. We've included a direct link. While you're there, we'd also appreciate it if you'd just take a moment to rate and review this podcast and share it with someone who you think may find it helpful. Together, we can raise awareness about the opioid epidemic and hopefully make a difference. Are you ready to protect the next generation from the dangers of substance use? Emily's Hope has created a comprehensive K through 12 substance use prevention curriculum designed to educate, empower, and equip students with the tools they need to make healthy choices. Our age appropriate lessons start in kindergarten and build through high school using science, real stories, and interactive learning to help kids understand their bodies, brains, and risk of drug use. We're already reaching thousands of students across multiple states, and we're just getting started. Visit emilyshopeedu.org to learn more, and share our curriculum with your school administrators and counselors. At Emily's Hope, we believe prevention begins with education. Let's work together to keep our kids safe. I really encourage people to, to really understand it. And it's not just Purdue that had to pay it's other, um, big pharma, other pharmaceutical companies and pharmacies such as Walgreens and CVS and others who didn't do enough, um, to monitor these prescriptions going out and didn't do enough to combat the problem. Yep. And in, and in fact, nobody's received money from Purdue yet. We're still waiting on that. Right, Still true. the biggest player, the perpetuator of all of this, we're still waiting for their money. But the rest of those lawsuits, yeah. Have, have most of them have been processed at this point. In fact, Purdue Pharma, the manufacturer of OxyContin, was finally sentenced recently after years of lawsuits and deaths from the opioid crisis. A judge ordered the company to pay five point five billion and approved a plan to dissolve it as part of a massive settlement. Alexis was there, standing alongside other grieving parents outside the courtroom, demanding more accountability. Here's a glimpse of that protest. Sacklers lie- People die. Sacklers lie- People die. Sacklers lie- People die. What do we want? Justice. When do we want it? Now. What do we want? Justice. When do we want it? Now. If you'd like to learn more about the Purdue Pharma settlement, we've been closely following the developments at Emily's Hope. Just visit our website, emilyshope.charity. We've posted a direct link in the show notes. There, you can stay up-to-date on the latest news headlines surrounding the opioid epidemic, substance use disorder, and mental health. You'll also find hundreds of Grieving Out Loud episodes, along with resources for helping loved ones struggling with substance use disorder You were so active in the formation of this, uh, opioid advisory committee and, and the funds coming into your state and what you saw were established status quo organizations big, maybe big health systems like we like that exist all over the country who already have millions of dollars getting. Tens of hundreds of thousands, if not millions more in settlement money. What's wrong with that? Aren't those the people working on the front lines? I mean, there's so many things wrong with it. Um, one, it's, you know, it's, uh, pumping money into a failing system. If that system was working, we wouldn't have this, you know, continuing, growing epidemic. Um, the other thing to recognize is these organizations that are getting this funding, they already had billable services there. Um. Their operations are already sustainable. And we know that as a fact because the research that we did found that they have millions and millions and millions of dollars in cash reserves, and so they don't need our blood money, um, to expand their services. The reality is, let's say an outpatient clinic wanted to expand their services, all they have to do is expand their services, then they increase their billing, they get, you know, more revenue from the billing. They don't, they're not waiting to, for opioid settlement funds to be able to do more. They can do more anytime they want. The evidence that we found in New York State that really proves this point is now we've pumped all these millions of dollars of opioid settlement funds into these existing systems that already had funding. You look at the dashboard that shows treatment. Admissions for New York State hasn't changed. No increased treatment, sub treatment, admissions, so all of that money is, is going to these systems and yet we have not increased the number of people who are getting treatment. So that's a problem. And what you're talking about there is accountability to show that the money that's going out is actually making a difference and helping people as it was intended. I think that's something an opioid advisory committee is supposed to be there for right to hold. the, the, the government agencies to hold the organizations receiving the funding to hold them all accountable. So Yeah. an advisory committee function like that? Is it functioning like, and we have one in my state. Is it functioning like that in New York State? Yeah. You know, I think, I think our advisory board is not the worst. I'll say that. I think that, um, I think they're not the worst. I think that they're making a lot of great recommendations and then our state isn't following. Them. They kind of, you know. Yeah. Yeah, so like as an example, the advisory board, the first year they issued their report, they mentioned that they think getting funding to grassroots community, grassroots community based organizations was important and it didn't happen. And so then the next year they strengthened their language and their report and said, you know, this really needs to happen. It still didn't happen the next year. They actually said, we want, and I think it was 20%, um. I don't remember the number exactly, but it's around there. But they said, we want this percentage to go to community-based and grassroots organizations. We want this percentage to go. And we still haven't seen that happen. And so the advisory board, I think they could do better, but they are, they are making some decent recommendations, but they're, the state isn't following it. frustrates me, disconnect. And so yes. gonna hold the state accountable? That's, I Yeah. where, um, things kind of fall apart here because this money can be going out. But if there's no one being held accountable, Right, how does that happen? right. And we, we've done everything, you know, I feel like as advocates, we've done everything we could. Can do to chase that answer down. Um, I met with someone from the State Attorney General's office to ask that question, um, and their answer was, oh, you have to go back to your legislators. The one who passed the laws. They're the ones who have to help enforce. That the laws are being followed, which feels a little weird to me because it's like we know that legislators are already busy. They've got a thousand issues on their plate. They felt like they passed a law. They're not gonna be out, they're not gonna, you know, they're not capable of going out there enforcing these laws. And it seems to be that there's no mechanism of accountability out there other than families. We need to hold them responsible. We need to say, this isn't acceptable. Right. So, so the whole focus that you found in your report and you run a grassroots organization, so some people could think that's self-serving of you to say, well, grassroots organizations like mine are not getting enough funding while you're giving it to these, uh, well established status quo organizations. Um, is it self-serving for you to, to look at this and talk about it? Um, I mean. Hopefully it's serving the community. That's the goal. So, you know what we know from the work that we do, and you know, you and I are so similar and I think most of the families that I know who have started something as a result of their loss, um, and it gives me chills to say it, but it's like we know where the gaps were. And so we're out there filling the gaps. We're not looking to do the same thing that's been done because we know that that existed and it didn't work. And so we're all out there like, what would've prevented our loved one from using in the first place? Or where did my loved one fall through the cracks or. Or the hundreds of people that we know who've died since then, where were they falling through the cracks? And community-based organizations are out there providing that work to fill in those gaps. Getting people to treatment, driving people to treatment, you know. Whatever, you know, prevention, harm, reduction. It's like we're all out there filling the gaps in of these systems that are already providing services that are important. Like I've never said that the services that are, that they're providing aren't important. They are. But what we know is the systems aren't working very well currently. And so the community-based organizations are the ones keeping people alive in the meantime and holding them up, making sure they get from, you know, one form of treatment to the next one. Because that's where a lot of the providers, they just drop people off in the middle. Um, so to me it's always been about what, how can these funds be used to actually turn the epidemic around? And it's. It'll never be doing the same thing that we've always done. We've gotta do something different. Um, I know that innovation is born from the community and innovation is born from the ground up, and so. All of us who are entering this work from a place of grief and trauma, I think that we're the ones who are the innovators, and if the people you know at the top paid attention and helped us replicate our programs, helped us expand them statewide or nationwide or whatever we could possibly turn this epidemic around, I think that we're the ones who hold the answers. We've paid the ultimate price. We know what failed us. Right, and whenever you talk about these large. Piles of money, there's always a money grab. It seems like going on, and there's always a fight over how it should be spent. And I saw that in my state. Um, our Department of Social Services has control of the money and there was criticism that they weren't giving out enough of it. And we did receive a couple of small grants. Initially and have since received a larger one at Emily's Hope. But the Attorney General came forward with the mayors of the two most populated cities in my state and said, two thirds of this money should go to these cities because that's where the people are to get people immediately into treatment. Well, that didn't go over very well. Um, but now it has forced, uh, the Department of Social Services to push out more of the money and different organizations are getting more of the money, but that's, it's still just a fraction of it. more money is still coming. So it seems like that fight over money and how people wanna use it. And then with each city county getting their own settlement money as well. I've heard of it being spent on things like an ice cream truck for a police department. You know, just in a ways that and, but nobody's really monitoring that or looking at that and, but you dove into it. I think that's what's interesting. Yeah. Yeah. I think, and there's, you know, I, I've said many times, like what's happening in New York at the state level might not be the most egregious thing that people have heard of. You know what I mean? Like, we've heard of examples, um, within our state, but county level spending, that's really egregious. You know, buying a fire truck or, you know, police vehicles and things like that. So there are, um. There are worse examples out there, but the reality is, again, these were funds that I think we would, we all had this hope. You know, I think, you know, I've been doing this now for 11 years and, and year after year, you know, going to legislators and talking to them about things that the community needed and people who were impacted needed. And a lot of times the answer is, well, if we can get it in the budget, well, if there's enough funds, well, it's like, so we're all waiting for these opioid settlement funds to come to finally do what they need to do to turn this epidemic around. And, and finally, you know, drop our overdose fatality rates back to what they were at pre epidemic levels. And then we just see them squandered, wasted, you know, and why, why didn't these states have a plan? Every single state should have done like a landscape analysis. Figure out what they have, what they don't have, who's filling in the gaps. You know, what, what, how these funds would've been best spent. I haven't heard of a single state that had a plan. My state is doing that analysis sort of after the fact, like they, they've already received quite a bit of the money, not all of it, and they've already given out some of it, but now they are doing an analysis on Good. it needs to go, and we're waiting for the consultant to come back with that this spring. So, um, I think, and they're spending about$300,000 on that analysis. know, of opioid settlement money, which is interesting. And I do think, uh, I do think there's value in that, Yeah. is certainly some value in that. Um, but it, it should have been done right away Yep. Should have been done before the funds even came. right? Yeah. other funds used to, uh, support that analysis, right? Right. can't always happen or doesn't always happen, but for other people who live in other states. Besides my state and your state, you went, you just went in and did this research on your own. It didn't What, what does it take to find, if you wanna know what your state is doing with their money, if you wanna be that person like you, who Yeah. what should you do, what advice do you have for people? So, I mean, the first place to start is opioid settlement tracker.com. It's an incredible website. Um, a young woman, Christine Min, I don't know if you've ever had her on, but she's amazing. but I Yeah, Yeah. you should. She's, she's incredible. Um, she created this, um, opioid settlement tracker and it has information about every single state, um, how transparent they're being about their funds, or at least how transparent they claim they're being, what publicly available information is out there. Um, we chose because New York State is claiming to be very transparent, so we chose to use the information that was publicly available. What we learned by doing the report and the research is they actually, there's a lot that's going on that is not transparent, um, but that. That was kind of beneficial that we learned by using the publicly available data that no, you know, the numbers aren't adding up. Um, we discovered quite a bit that they were doing that was, um, that's very secretive, you know, selecting organizations and giving them funds without an RFA at all. So just handing. just for people at home that don't know, an RFA would be like a request for a proposal. Request for application. Yep. Yep. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. So, um. um, I think any, you know, in my mind, anybody can do this, but you know what, we, um, I would encourage people, we just hosted a webinar yesterday to, to teach people how to go about doing what we did. It will be on YouTube. So if people want to follow that process and do it themselves, um. You know, one of the things that we did we're, I always say we're a scrappy organization. We're like tiny but mighty. So I looked around and it's like, what do I already have? Well, I have a couple really sharp interns, and so though I tapped into those interns to do research and do data analysis, um. And I connected with a PhD student, um, who led our writing team. And so I, you know, paid her a very reasonable $20 an hour, you know, something that we could afford and pulled together a report that's, you know, you, you'd think it came out of a think tank. You know, it's really an impressive report. Um, so I think that people just have to be clever, think about what resources they have, who they know, you know, who they can tap into, and. And, um, dive in. Well, I think a couple things there. We will put a link to your report in, in this episode, and we will also put a link to your YouTube video Awesome. interested in watching your webinar on how to do this themselves in their own state, which we need as many eyes on this as possible, and it needs to be as transparent as possible. And I always say, as a former investigative journalist, I admire the fact that, you know, you dug into these. Uh, numbers and you started really examining what was happening. And I always wanna be as transparent as possible because I see such value in that as well. And I just think it can be just so frustrating for so many people. Do you think there are steps like that should be done in every state or is every state different in treating the. Overdose epidemic and ending it because we can't accept 72 or 70,000 deaths a year or whatever it is right now. That's what it was when my daughter died in 2018, and of course then it jumped way up, but that was un It's unacceptable. We can't just say it's okay. Yeah, no, I mean I, I think every state should have a landscape analysis to figure out, you know, what they really need in their state that. Has to include community input. So, uh, you know, when I say a landscape analysis, yes, it's, it's somebody, some expert looking at what the resources are that are available, how many treatment centers there are, how many treatment beds, you know, all of those sorts of things. But it's also going back to the community and you really have to, I mean, every state is different from the west side to the east side, you know, we're in New York. People think of New York City. We have New York City, but I'm up in a rural community. And so, you know, it's vastly different, the resources available in each community. So, um, I think that every state needs to do a landscape analysis, but they really should go county by county and, and host listening sessions. They should do a data survey. They should survey people who have been directly impacted, ask them what made, made a difference for them, or would make a difference for them, or would have made a difference for them. Figure out from the people what's needed, because it's really the people who know it's not, you know, it's experts just, they just, um, they miss out if they don't talk to directly impacted people. Um, so I, I mean, I think that that's the starting ground for all of this. And then if there are advisory panels, which I think advisory boards are good, but they should always include people with recent relevant experience. Um, in our board, we, you know, I think it's a third of the members are required to have experience, um, but it doesn't mean it's recent or relevant, you know, and I'm, I am sorry if it offends people, but like being in recovery from alcohol for 30 years is not the same as suffering from opioid addiction. It's not recent or relevant. And so I think. You need recent relevant experience, but we've seen with the few people who have lived experience on our board, they often get driven off the boards. It's crazy. I mean, like this, um, woman, Stephanie Marcano, I mean, she's such a rock star. She lost her son. Um. Uh, I think it's, she called, I think it's a suicide related overdose. Um, but he struggled with substance use. She started an organization. I mean, she's just absolutely incredible. She was on the board and she was the biggest fighter on the board, and they drove her off. And I think it's that, that goes to show we need people who speak those truths. We need people with lived experience on the boards because they're, they're gonna force change. That's what she was trying to do. And Stephanie, I know her and she's been on the podcast and she is, she's a fighter and she is vocal and the kind of person that you want on those types of oversight boards for Yep. And so whenever you have. This kind of money. And you have politics in play, you also have bureaucracy whenever you have government involved, right? So the bureaucracy can be so frustrating, I think, to small organizations that don't have a lot of resources, um, to put into, you know, applying for these things and then just all of the hoops you have to jump through could be a lot. Yeah. Yeah, it is a lot. And I think, um, you know, that I would say the, the next thing is really an equitable distribution of funding. So making sure that funding gets to these small grassroots organizations. Um. Even if it's capacity building, like helping them learn how to apply for grants or helping them learn how to become a licensed program or you know, whatever it is that helps them. Continue to serve their community because without a doubt, they're doing something positive in their communities, and most of them are, have become really financially efficient. You know, it's like, I, I was thinking about this on my way home today to, to meet with you. It's like I grew up poor. And so when you grow up poor you, you learn how to make a dollar stretch. And so I think of that in the same way with small, under-resourced organizations. It's like most. I. I'm laughing'cause I can relate. Today I was just negotiating with something. Our office needs something and I'm trying to get the best price possible. I just a couple hundred dollars off of this. You know that most organizations would just pay the bill. Right? I mean, especially for profit organizations. But when you're talking about donor dollars and you're a small organization, every dollar matters. And That's right. think people that work in the for-profit world off understand that about non-profits or charities. Yeah. That's right. Yeah. This. with so little. This conversation reminds me of something funny the other day. I met with, um, a hospital executive, and the hospital is a nonprofit and, and I won't, I won't go into what the conversation was about, but I was, you know, talking about the struggles of a community-based organization trying to survive. And she said, oh, I know I used to work for nonprofits. And I was like, you still do, Well, it's a but they lose sight of it. health systems that are nonprofits are definitely a different animal than That's right. organizations. So, um, completely different. And so if you, what's next for you? Now that you've done this report? You're talking about it, you've done a webinar, uh, will you go back to your state legislature and try to make more, how, how do you facilitate change from all of this and, Yeah. do even in their own states to facilitate change? Yeah, well the, the really big and good news is as a result of that report, you know, we, we went up to Albany and showed many legislators a draft of the report just before we published it, kind of as a courtesy. Um, and asked them, what do you wanna do to help us out here, because this is gonna be embarrassing. Um, the good news is we have on our senate side and our, um. Assembly side, we have legislators ready to carry the legislation with the amendments. So that's amazing. Um, funny thing about advocacy is they say, can you bring us the language? Which it's like, again, you're asking a tiny community-based organization now to come up with legislative language, you know, that we need past. Luckily, um, legal Action Center has taken a, you know, a very big interest in our report and the changes that we want, and they volunteered to write the language for us for that legislation. Um, so I'm just waiting on the language. I've got, um. Three, I've got three levels of legislators ready to carry. Um, the, the legislation for us. So we have our preferred legislators, we have backups and backups to them. So as soon as I get that language, we're gonna get that law. We're gonna get the legislation on the books, and we're gonna try to get it passed. My, my hope was this year, but every week that goes by that I'm waiting for the language. It makes it, um, less chance. Yeah. set, when does your legislative session end? The first week of June. So Oh. really, we're really, um, I'm really getting stressed about that because I wanted the momentum of people really being concerned right now to get that legislation passed. But, but, we'll, you know, we'll do our best. We also did go to each of the major agencies that are distributing funds, um, and met with them directly and just. Said a lot of this you could fix, you know what I mean? Like they don't need legislation to do the right thing. They could just do the right thing. Um, the largest agency, which is New York State Oasis, who controls our um, spending of the opioid settlement funds, and there are treatment. Regulator, they were not interested in the conversation. Um, they just were like, okay, thank you for the information. And we provided real concrete solutions. Um, so that was frustrating. We're waiting. We also met with the, um, New York State Department of Health, and we're waiting for their answer. Um, and we're going to speak to our comptroller and ask them to do an audit because at this point we've exposed enough. Um, of what feels like really improper handling of the funds that we want an audit of the funds. Well, I think there should be an audit of all of the funds in every state. I mean, it Yes. when you're talking about this much money and so many people just trying to get their share of it, uh, so to speak. And just the fact that government waste we know does happen. that's right. fraud does happen within governments. We've seen that on large scales in certain states and you know, it's just we cannot protect this money enough if you ask me. And it does need to go to organizations that are out there on the ground, boots on the ground, doing the hard work and find Right. the gaps.'cause we have so many people falling through the cracks. Yeah, that's right. Totally agreed. Have you lost a loved one to overdose or fentanyl poisoning? I'd like to invite you to share their story on our new Emily's Hope Memorial website called More Than Just a Number. They were our children, siblings, cousins, husbands, wives, aunts, uncles, and friends. So much more than just a number. You can submit a memorial today on morethanjustanumber.org. Every state is handling opioid settlement dollars a little differently. So what's your state doing? Check the show notes for a link to the opioid settlement tracker's state-by-state guides. so I was just thinking of a really good example of, you know, the difference between a community based organization and a large system getting a specific funding for something. With the opioid settlement funds, we, when we were doing our report, we found that there was this thing called, uh, transportation initiative. So a whole bunch of organizations in New York State got $1.6 million each for transportation initiative. Yeah, so much money. money for transportation. Yeah. so much. We as a tiny community-based organization, we, there's a family who lost their son, the Jamon Turco family. They host a fundraiser every single year. They donate about $5,000 and we use that as our transportation budget to get people to treatment. Like that's what they wanted it for. That's what we use it for. When somebody needs to go to treatment, even if it's like. Three hours away. We have community members who are like trained by us on how to facilitate giving somebody a ride to treatment. We give them a hundred bucks. So I can give a lot of people a ride to treatment for 5,000 bucks. yeah. So So we, I see this grant and I'm like, $1.6 million. Like, whew. You know what I, what I could do with that, you know, I'd be providing treatment for, or transportation for everybody. For everything. So. Simultaneous to publishing this report. This was like days before the report was crazy. This woman who runs a hotline, who lost her daughter, she runs a hotline in a county, a rural county, like. Two or three hours from me. She will, from time to time call me because she's like, oh, can you help me find treatment or can whatever, you know, I help her out whenever we can. She calls me and says, I have this young woman in her twenties addicted to fentanyl, ready to go to treatment. She lined a treatment bed up for herself. She did all that work herself. The treatment facility promised to give her a ride to treatment, and now they called her today, she needs to get there. I think it was like the next day. She needs to get there. The next day, the treatment facility called her and said, we can't provide a ride, but we still have the bed. If you can get yourself here. It's like three hours away. So I'm like, oh, so who's the treatment provider? Well, wouldn't you know that treatment provider? It's a huge conglomerate. They have multiple locations across the state. They receive not one, but two of those $1.6 million grants for transportation and, and I feel my face starting to snarl because I'm so mad. And two other providers in our county and the county that the gal was in also received those grants. So I was like, that's funny you should say that, Linda. Let me look up and see who got these grants. We can see if we can get in touch of with one of them. Somebody should be able to provide her a ride of treatment and this is on the weekend. We could not find one provider who we could reach on the weekend who received a $1.6 million grant for transportation to take this young woman to treatment. Huh. Well that is disheartening and shameful. So do you know what they're doing with the money? You probably don't know. Nope. And I, I contacted one of the treatment providers in our area and said, Hey, I learned about this grant. We couldn't contact you over the weekend. Tell me, you know, and the first, the ED said, I'll connect you with the director of transportation. Then I got another email that said, oh, is it turns out it's only for transportation for our clients. Hmm. And they can't be using all the funds. I mean, it's, yeah. It's so much money. It's so much money. so much money. And I think that there were 12, I'm pretty sure there were 12 of these $1.6 million grants distributed all across New York State. So it's like nobody should need a ride at this point. And. It should cover the treatment too. It should cover the cost of the treatment. Right, and it points to how inefficient our state systems are. Like you or I probably already would've thought of, why isn't there a hotline for anybody who needs treatment in New York State to call a hotline and say, I need a ride. And then that hotline connects them to one of those providers that got $1.6 million and says, we got a ride for you. Right. There's no system for this money. It's like every provider got money. We don't know what each provider is doing. We don't know how to access the services, and, and I feel like a community-based organization or somebody who's savvy about wanting to make sure that everybody gets access to treatment, we would've come up with a better, more efficient cost, better cost efficient, efficient system than what the state just did, threw all this money out there. We don't know how it's being used. Right, right. It's just like splat and what, where's the follow up? What's happening? Yep. yeah. Very valid questions. And wow, what an example. Well keep doing the work that you're doing and thank you so Thank you. for everything that you have done and what you've really brought to light about this money, because it's important that people know how it's being spent, that it, that the public knows and that it's being spent appropriately. Yeah. Thank you so much. Thanks for getting the word out there. Oh, you're welcome Thanks again for listening to this episode of Grieving Out Loud. Be sure to join us each week for a new episode. You can also find hundreds of other Grieving Out Loud conversations anytime on our website, emilyshope.charity. Thank you again for listening. Until next time, wishing you faith, hope, and courage. This podcast is produced by Casey Wandenberg King and Kayli Fitz.