Angela: 0:07

Hi, everyone. It's Angela Kenecke. I had the privilege of meeting our next podcast guest in person after we did this podcast interview virtually. Von Webb is such a personable and dynamic guy, and I am so saddened by the loss of his son to fentanyl. He's doing a lot of work in his son's name, just like I'm doing in Emily's name. And what brought us together is an upcoming Next Star special. It's actually a follow up to their first special that already came out called Saving a Generation. And they brought Several of us parents together who were featured in the special to Dallas to sit together and talk, and it was really quite wonderful, and that will be coming up this spring, but in the meantime, I'm excited to bring you my conversation with Vaughn Webb. For so many young athletes, playing a college sport is the dream, but for Talyn Webb, one wasn't enough. He excelled in two, from standout basketball player to football star at Southern Utah University. Talen was the kind of athlete who seemed unstoppable, disciplined, passionate, and in peak physical condition.

Vonn Webb: 1:32

their defensive back of the year, senior year and junior year, they won a championship.

Angela: 1:44

Taylin's dad, Von Webb, who also coached at the collegiate level, says he didn't have any major concerns about his son. But little did he know, his son had a secret struggle.

Vonn Webb: 1:56

He had gotten injured and and his drift coach had t one of the hardest workin room in the whole nine ya

Angela: 2:04

and that battle has made a new playbook to transfo Ovan. It's great to actually connect with you. We are connected in maybe an unconventional way. We were both featured in a national Fentanyl special produced by Nextar, which has about 180 TV stations across the country. And both of our children's stories were featured in that special and it can be found online. I'm going to put a link to it. But I was really moved and so touched by your son's story and everything that you're doing.

Vonn Webb: 2:49

Well, you know what? It's a pleasure to be here. Thank you for having me. And I also was moved by Emily's story. You know, and I sit back and I go, Sometimes you feel like you're the only one when you deal with these things, right? It's just you, but there's a lot of people out there, so thank you for having me.

Angela: 3:06

You're welcome. So many of us out there, sadly, I always say I think we're at a tipping point where enough of us have been affected now that there has to be change, right? But the one thing that you and I have in common that not everybody has to deal with is Really, we are both public people.

Vonn Webb: 3:23

Right, right, right. Yeah, me coaching basketball for all these years and you being on the news and as an anchor person and so we're in everybody's faces anyways, right? So we, here we go, you know, dealing with this.

Angela: 3:35

Did that make it challenging for you or harder for you being in the public eye or what do you think about that?

Vonn Webb: 3:42

I've been very blessed as a coach to be able to coach some very, very good players and had a lot of success And so I've always been in that realm, right? Always in the public eye since I started coaching. So it's, you know, sometimes it's hard when you have personal stuff to keep it private.

Angela: 4:04

Vaughn was a highly accomplished and respected coach at both the high school and collegiate levels. At Washington Union High School in Fresno, California, he led his team to multiple state championships and earned the title of California State Coach of the Year. He had an eye for talent, helping shape some of the best basketball players in the state, including future NBA stars such as Chris Jeffries. Deshaun Stevenson and more. Later, he brought his skills to the college scene, coaching at schools like Fresno State.

Vonn Webb: 4:40

And my son, a really good athlete, and he played Division I basketball and football, so he was in the public eye, so we're kind of out there exposed anyways, you know, and you can deal with things publicly, and you just try to deal with them the best way you can.

Angela: 4:59

Vaughn was incredibly close with his youngest son, Talon, They shared love of the game that brought them even closer. In fact, Vaughn coached Taylin during his senior year of high school.

Vonn Webb: 5:13

He begged me to come back and coach him. And I had been done with coaching. I was like, I'm done with this adult business. Oh, come on. Please, pops. Please come back. Come back and coach

Angela: 5:23

him.

Vonn Webb: 5:23

Come coach me. But that is so

Angela: 5:25

sweet because not every kid would want their dad to coach them. I coached him. I coached him. You want me? You

Vonn Webb: 5:33

know I am a tough coach. Well. I'm real adult. No, please, please. Okay. So I did it. It was great.

Angela: 5:46

After high school, Taylin went on to play division one basketball at Cal state Northridge, which would be a dream come true for many athletes.

Vonn Webb: 5:57

During spring break, he tells me, he goes, I don't think I want to play here anymore. I'm done with this. Cause things weren't going very well. I said, you're a freshman. Don't worry about it. You'll be okay. Fight through it and you'll be all right. So we talked about it again, and we decided to make a move, and he went to a junior college in Texas, and went down there and played there, and he started to get re recruited, you know, that type of thing, but he was just like, he called me at 1 or 2 in the morning. He was in Denver for, his flight was delayed through Denver, going back to Lubbock. And he said, Dick, I'm watching this story on Victor Cruz, and I really like his story, and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, and I was like, okay, I go, why are you calling me this early in the morning to tell me, he goes, I don't think I want to play basketball anymore, and I said, what? I don't think I want to play basketball anymore, you know, I kind of lost my passion for it, I want to do something different, I said, well, what do you want to do? And he said, I want to play football. I had myself played basketball and football in college, so I kind of had a feeling that was the kind of route that he wanted to go.

Angela: 7:00

After a lot of thought, Taylin walked away from the sport he knew so well and took a chance on something completely new. Even though he'd never played football before, he landed a spot at a Division I program, Southern Utah University.

Vonn Webb: 7:17

You know, he's a very good athlete, 6'11 high jumper, 23 foot long jumper, he was a basketball player, you know, he was fast. Those guys looked at him as a good athlete and so they loved him. He was like a real inspiration to those guys just because he had came from a non football situation. Ended up being their defensive back of the year, senior year, and junior year they won a championship. He had a really good football career, I was proud of him, I was really happy for him and proud of him because he had never done it before.

Angela: 7:46

Sounds like he really followed in his dad's footsteps in so many ways.

Vonn Webb: 7:50

Better than mine. He always wanted to beat me at everything and be better after all. You got me son, good job.

Angela: 8:02

In addition to his athletic achievements, Vaughn was also proud of who Taylin was off the field.

Vonn Webb: 8:11

This is the kind of kid he was. He went to a strange house in southern Utah for, I think it was Thanksgiving dinner one year. Well, it was a roommate of his, his roommate's grandfather. has a heart attack and dies right there in front of them all. Everybody's just sitting there like in shock. They're like, after Blue, everybody's sitting there looking at each other. Well, Taylin, jumps down and starts giving CPR. Cause he had stopped breathing. They call 911. He starts giving CPR and doing the chest compressions and then brings him back to life right as the paramedics come walking in the door. And this kid had no training for anything. He just had to respond to the call. But you know what? He didn't even call me and tell me that thing. His roommate called me about a week later, and he goes, Coach, did Taylor tell you what happened? I was like, what are you talking about? He saved my grandfather's life, you know. And he told me the story, and I go,

Angela: 9:05

what? I

Vonn Webb: 9:06

can't even tell. If you tell me that, you

Angela: 9:09

know. So he was modest. He wasn't looking for the glory. Vaughn believed his son was on the right track and says he never had any major worries about him.

Vonn Webb: 9:26

He was always a responsible, committed athlete. You know, he was a great brother. He was a great young man, you know. I never, I, I never worried about him. I, you know, that was part of my whole thing. I just, you know. We talked on a consistent basis. He stayed in touch.

Angela: 9:47

But even though they talked on a regular basis, Taylin was hiding a secret from his dad. After getting injured playing football, he started taking Percocet to manage the pain.

Vonn Webb: 10:01

And I had no, no knowledge. I mean, I was around him in the whole nine yards, and his girlfriend or friend had told me that every now and then when he was feeling something, he would take a pill or whatever the case may be. And I was just like, wow. I had no knowledge of any of this before, you know, I didn't know.

Angela: 10:18

So somehow he must have obtained a Percocet that was a fake pill that had fentanyl in it.

Vonn Webb: 10:25

That's exactly what happened because he gets a Percocet because he's been trying to work it out in the whole nine yards, you know. He was getting ready to try out to go play up in Canada.

Angela: 10:34

Oh, for the Canadian Football League?

Vonn Webb: 10:37

Yeah, and after I got the call in the whole nine yards and went through all that, We didn't know what the reason he was, we came back that it was. accidents, you know, overdoses. And so it was, only way it would have been was he had gotten a bad pill.

Angela: 10:51

It's amazing that this little bit of fentanyl can take down a big, strong man like that. I often think about that, like it doesn't discriminate, it doesn't matter who it is.

Vonn Webb: 11:02

It doesn't matter. And since then, I've had multiple friends of mine. Who have asked a family member and same thing, they thought they had one thing and it was another.

Angela: 11:16

Those fake prescription pills that actually contain fentanyl are a big driver of our nation's overdose epidemic. In fact, the DEA has sent out a public safety alert warning that half of the illicit pills tested in 2024 contained a potentially deadly dose of fentanyl. That's actually down though from 70% in 2023.

Vonn Webb: 11:41

And for me, not knowing that there was ever any issues, not knowing what was going on, I didn't even know what fentanyl was, you know, to be totally honest with you. And so I'm just like, when that report came back and it said no fentanyl, I was going, what is that? You know, I really didn't know. I truly, truly, truly had no knowledge about fentanyl. because I had never experienced anything. And so that's kind of how people are now. I think

Angela: 12:11

Vaughn says his son's death left him not only shocked and heartbroken, but also deeply affected Taylin's six siblings, adding another layer to the family's grief.

Vonn Webb: 12:25

It's devastating. It was very devastating for his sisters and brothers because had a very good relationship where he was very close and this was really shocked every single one of them in to this day I'll get a call from him out of the blue or text out of the blue that they just met three men And he was one of those kids that had a great personality Everyone that I ever met that has met him and I know his men tailing they loved him He walked into the room and room lights up, you know big personality

Angela: 12:55

and once you got over the initial shock That you decided to use your platform as a coach. Tell me what happened.

Vonn Webb: 13:02

Well, you know, I was talking to some friends of mine. A real good friend of mine, Aranda. That's his name. I had her, Sanchez. And these are guys that I've been knowing forever. And they knew Taylor. And they coached him as well as I did. And we thought about it and thought about it and said, Man, we just gotta do something. And it is an honor for one, but to try to help save other people. And as we were sitting there talking, we came up with the decision to starting our process and then to be able to help as many people as possible. And that's, that was just my thought process. I didn't want any parent to feel the way I felt. If I could help them save their child. If I can help them, I want to help them. I didn't want any athlete to go through anything that they were going through and not realize there's people out there that they can talk to if there's issues for 'em. You know, I want to make sure that I put as much awareness as possible because it's about helping the next person. That's the kind of person he thinking was. You know, he coached little young kids, and at his memorial service, this young lady came from Southern California, came up to Fresno, she's like 10, 11 years old, one of his students that he was teaching and coaching, and it just broke my heart, and I was like, I mean, give them the information and let them realize how real this is, and how serious it is, and how deadly this stuff is, if you get a hold of it on purpose or accidentally, it don't matter, you know?

Angela: 14:23

Vons started a non profit named Stay Shaded to raise awareness about the fentanyl crisis and help prevent further tragedies. The group also works to connect people battling substance use disorder with the treatment they desperately need.

Vonn Webb: 14:39

We have a project in it called Athletes Against Fentanyl, AAF. Please have a bigger platform, right? And they have a bigger voice when it comes to being able to help spread things like we did with our team at Fresno State. You know, our whole team did the PSA and you saw the PSA and that went over very well within the community.

Angela: 15:03

Here's a clip from the PSA featuring Fresno State basketball players. They're athletes who are role models in the community, especially for young aspiring players.

Vonn Webb: 15:18

In a flash, it's over. It's a wrap. No final buzzer. Fentanyl is a poison and it can and does kill. Even the crumb of it won't care who you are, where you're from, or if it's your first pill, it will block your dreams and steal your future. And it was great cause I mean all over the place people saw and they loved it and I was like, you know what, I just want to continue to do this. This is what I want to do because I want to make it. That's how Taylor was. I decided to do Stay Shaded. That's the kind of person he was. You know, so I'm like, I have to do this.

Angela: 15:54

Where does the term Stay Shaded come from?

Vonn Webb: 15:57

Well, you know, he and I, before we got off the phone, he'd always say, we'd talk, talk, talk, talk. He'd always call me Pops. Wow. I got to go. He says, stay spade the problem. I said, stay spade the sign. And that just meant for us to stay cool, do what you gotta do, handle you, you know, we're going to be okay. You know, if you need something, call me, you know, yadda, yadda. And so it was something that we said every day.

Angela: 16:20

Yeah. So it has an extra meaning for you, for sure.

Vonn Webb: 16:25

Yeah.

Angela: 16:26

Does this work? Does it help your grief? And how is your grief kind of showing up? I don't get many men on this podcast to talk to me about their grief. Sometimes I do. Yeah. But it feels like it's a lot of moms talking about it and talking about their grief. So how does that show up in your life? I'm

Vonn Webb: 16:45

in grief every day. That was my guy. After I feel it and go through it and deal with it for that time period, it could be twice or, you know, three times a day, just depending on our goals. But someone told me, well, coach, every time you do him talking to you or him reach it out to you, you know, you got to just. You know, and I just think of positive things, as many positive things as I can, and I've gotten better. I've improved, you know, in dealing with them, breaking down as much as I did before. Goes back to kind of what you asked me earlier, you know, the reason why I got back into the college game was because I thought it would help me deal with, and it did, because I was around players. You know, it was like I was running him on a regular basis every day. Then it just got to a point where I was like, you know, do more. I got to do something and kind of work. Everything kind of worked out the way that it did. So I can go right in the segue right into. where I'm at today.

Angela: 17:53

Vaughn has switched from coaching people on how to play basketball to educating them about the dangers of illicit drugs.

Vonn Webb: 18:05

I'm doing a lot of public speaking, you know, because I figure if people can hear me, I can tell them a story and they can hear his story, you know, it'll help them. And I think that helps me too, because I get to talk to people and be around people in Wayne Kuhlman and just realize that I'm doing something that I feel that he would be proud of.

Angela: 18:23

As a coach, I would think that all of your skills from coaching really translate into that in carrying Taylin's story forward and talking to students and athletes and others.

Vonn Webb: 18:34

Oh, without question. You know, without question. And, you know, I was a teacher for many, many, many years and I was a principal. I've dealt with students and student athletes. It helps a whole lot that I've had that in my past to be able to deliver the message now.

Angela: 18:51

Do you think the message is getting out there? I'm thinking there's a little more attention on this crisis. I mean, it's been going on for years. The numbers have gotten worse. The overdose deaths dropped a little bit in the last year nationwide, not in my community, but nationwide. Do you think this special is like the one we were both featured in? Do you think you're talking, do you think it's making a difference? Are non profits, do you think it's making a difference?

Vonn Webb: 19:16

I pray that it is, but I, do I think so? Yes, but not enough.

Angela: 19:20

Not enough.

Vonn Webb: 19:21

I don't think there's enough. There needs to be more awareness, more information, and more conversation. You know, so it needs to be more of those out there. It needs to be more opportunities. That's part of the reason why, the main reason why I'm doing the Athletes Against Fentanyl Day, if, because. I feel that those athletes rocked in the spectrum of getting that awareness of getting it out there, you know, and so I tell my guys all the time and kids that I talk to when you leave here, I want you to go talk to one person and tell one person what fentanyl is, what it's all about. What you've learned here today, just tell one person. You know, and so with that being the case, it can help spread. I mean, I've talked to a lot of folks that had no idea what it is, just like I was, had no, no understanding, but I think there's needs to be more to answer your question. Yeah.

Angela: 20:10

And I feel like every time another person dies and another family is grieving, you know, it's just, which breaks my heart because it's so unnecessary. People don't have to be dying from fentanyl, you know, and I just think that it's just so sad, whether it be someone just. Getting a bad pill or whether it be someone suffering from substance use disorder doesn't really matter. It's just we have to do better.

Vonn Webb: 20:34

A hundred percent. And I was telling my wife, Michelle, No, the deal is here, it's just like other drugs, right? We're not going to stop the sale of drugs. These things are going to happen. It's been heroin and cocaine and marijuana and pills and everything. It's been around all the time, you know, but to me, the mission is to get the information out there so that people can make better decisions. For more information, visit www. FEMA. gov and try to help prevent the young ones as they're growing. Don't do it. You know, it goes back to the, to the 80s when you're talking about, you know, saying no to drugs. And I think that was Nancy Reagan's deal, you know, but to me, it's about. Trying to get these young kids to realize how serious this is not your acid in your in your marijuana in your this is death It'll kill you. It's like playing Russian roulette a reverse Russian roulette, right? And so my mission is to try to get these young kids to understand it. Really don't do it stay away from it And try to get the next person to not do it, to stay away from it, to leave it alone.

Angela: 21:34

Right. I always say the days of experimentation are the days where we think it's okay for our kids, you know, to do something or try something are long gone. You cannot take anything from anybody, and we're trying to get that message across at Emily's Hope, and we have more and more schools, you know, signing up for our, we start in kindergarten with some very important age appropriate messages for kids about, you know, who's a trusted adult, Medication versus candy, and I think we have to start younger and younger because I'm sure Taylin didn't know. No. He didn't know the risk he was taking.

Vonn Webb: 22:07

I didn't even know. And I'm an adult. Right. And, you know, I'm speaking at a school in California, again, Red Ribbon Week out there. One of the elementary school asked me to come, you know, and they told me, you think it's too early to deal with these youngsters. I said, you know what, it's never too early. I'm gonna be honest with you, you gotta find a way to communicate it to them, but it's never too early. I have a six year old granddaughter, obviously we talk about her Uncle Tay, you know, but I'm telling her, you can't take anything from anybody, you know, cause you know, there's people on campuses and anything can happen. It could be at any time, you know, and so, yeah, I agree with you wholeheartedly and I'd like to talk to you more about your age appropriate information that you have.

Angela: 22:51

And I'll share all that with you. We share it with our audience all the time. You can encourage, you know, your school to implement it because we give it away as part of our mission right now. And it's a really great curriculum and we just have to get these messages and school is a good place to get that message. It's from your teacher or your guidance counselor. And one other question I had for you was, How does Taylin live on to the work that you do?

Vonn Webb: 23:17

Well, I mean, everything that I do, I talk about him and I talk about who he was as a young man, but who he was as a person, as an athlete, and what his dreams and goals were. And as I'm speaking to people, I try to let them realize that, you know, he's my why, which is so important to me because There are other kids, other children that are out there and they are their parents. Why? Right. You know, what you're doing, the reason why you're doing what you're doing is because of your daughter. And as you do that, you let them realize this is why. And for me, Taylor, if it was someone else, if it was another one of our children, then Taylor would be right here with me doing what I'm doing, trying to help the next first.

Angela: 23:58

Is your coaching career done now, do you think, or do you see yourself going back to coaching at some point?

Vonn Webb: 24:05

I don't know. I've been offered a few opportunities and right now that's not where I'm at, you know, and I've done it. I did it for 30 years, 35 years, like I said, a lot of things and was able to do some things. And I think my next step is, you know, you got to be able to look in the rearview mirror and see what you did and be proud of it and keep pushing. Because if you keep looking where you did before, you're never going to get to where you're going to get because you're going to hurt yourself or somebody else. Right. As you're going to force. I just want to continue to help as many people as possible, and this is coaching in a way, you know, when I'm talking and I'm out speaking in different places and I mean, I've spoken to college teams, high school teams, high school student bodies in the whole nine yards, right? This is somewhat coaching. I get my opportunity to express myself, my opinion and my thoughts and try to help people and try to motivate people and doing these things. It's just coaching in a different way. It's just not with sports.

Angela: 25:00

And it's a different chapter of your life and not necessarily a chapter by your own choosing. That's what I often think, like, I never thought my life would go in this direction that it has gone in, where this being my sort of life's work, my life's crusade to try to prevent these deaths. And the same thing with you, we did other things for a very long time and I just never imagined. But it's challenging, it can be rewarding, but also it's not a choice I would have made

Vonn Webb: 25:27

to do it. Absolutely right. If I didn't feel it was necessary for me because of my situation and what I've dealt with, then I probably wouldn't be doing it. But, if I have to do what I'm doing and no one else, the next person doesn't have to do this, doing my job. The few people that have to do what we're doing, if that number goes down, if it goes down by one, we're doing our job.

Angela: 25:49

It's always about trying to prevent. The next person I'm having to go through the next parent, especially, I think anybody who loses a loved one, there's such collateral damage from these losses. And I just was speaking to a group yesterday and someone in the audience pointed out just from substance use alone. There's such collateral damage. Everyone in the family is hurt, you know, let alone when they die. And so this is something that I guess we're on the front lines and that's what it is.

Vonn Webb: 26:20

That's exactly what it is. And, you know, there's. Generals and there's privates, right, you know, and, and I just consider myself a general out there leading the bus, trying to make sure we do as much as we can and direct people in the right direction and try to make the right decisions and do what's best, you know, so that they don't put themselves or anybody else in harm's way with this trail.

Angela: 26:42

Yeah, that's a great analogy. I like that. Well, thank you so much for the work that you're doing. Thank you for coming on the podcast and sharing Talyn, his story and. Yeah, it's unbelievable to me. It's so unnecessary that we lose some of the best and brightest. I always say, look at all the lost potential to the world from these kids that we're losing and, you know, the songs that could have been written, the athletes, the, entrepreneurs, everything. It's sad. And they titled that special, we were on saving a generation. I think I said we're losing a generation. We really are with Fenton will be the number one killer, you know, of young people.

Vonn Webb: 27:19

And that's my thing. And that's my thing. It needs to be more awareness. It needs to be more opportunity forward. Because if you have that, at least you know, that you're putting it out there, put it out there for kids to make better decisions, conscious decisions about what they're doing and how they're doing and all this, right. You know, but. And this needs to be more information and more awareness so that you can hopefully help people to be able to make better decisions.

Angela: 27:43

Yeah. I agree with you. Well, thank you so much, Vaughn. I really appreciate it. And thank you for listening to this episode of Grieving Out Loud. If you found it helpful, please take a moment to rate and review this podcast along with sharing it with friends and family. You can find more episodes, hear about our K 12 education curriculum, and read the latest news headlines about the fentanyl epidemic and substance use disorder on our website, emilyshope. charity. Together, we can make a difference and save lives. Thanks for listening. Until next time, wishing you faith, hope, and courage. This podcast is produced by Casey Weinenberg King and Marlee Miller.